I've about had it up to here....

[DanMC]

Hi, I don't mean to be a smart alec but I'm a firm believer that buying new and treating your gear right by using the best motor oil (synthetic 100%) ,ethanol free gas (here in western Canada I only know of Shell V-Power ...that's the premium here at $1.40/liter) and beeing a Honda diehard....it's working for us.Just my .2¢ Canadian !....BTW picked up some Amsoil gas stabilizer....any thoughts ?

 

[turbotodd]

The only "downside" to 4 stroke is the fuel system.

"today's" fuel is made for cars and trucks, that never let fuel sit in the tank for more than, say, 2-3 days.

That said, it starts to sour in about a week or less. 4 strokes have such small (tiny) passages in the carb that they plug easy. EFI motors have the same inherent problem but with no carburetor. Injectors and a fuel pump screen to replace, which is a little more involved and expensive than a carb cleaning.

I've noticed on mine (F25 yamaha) that if I don't use the fuel for more than a week, or maybe a little longer, it doesn't run quite right. hesitation sometimes. Doesn't make you think until you're 5 miles from where daylight is pumped in and it doesn't quite sound right. And you're the only soul on the lake and the cellphone doesn't work. (experience speaking). So I have learned myself to use an ounce of prevention. When done fishing, get home, dump the gas into the lawn mower tank or the car. Remove carb drain screw, drain the bowl-completely-then start the engine/let it idle for a few seconds until it dies. Reinstall bowl drain screw and wait til next time I need to use it at which time I'll put about 1/2 tank of fuel in the boat (1.5 gal roughly), start it before I head to the lake, make sure it runs/idles/starts like it should. I can do it, but I hate cleaning a carb on the water. The other issue with 4 stroke is lack of fuel usage. You don't need to carry 6 gallons of gas unless you're running something like a 50+ HP motor and going a long way with it. I carry a 3 gal tank. I've run at 18-25 miles in a day's fishing and still had plenty left in the tank to dump into the mower when I got home. So it goes old before I ever use it up. Going to a 3 gal when you used to carry 6 also removes some weight from the boat, which helps offset the weight of the heavier 4 stroke motor.

 

[Zum]

Wow...and to think this year brought my old 87 30hp out the basement, attached it to the boat and headed to the lake.
I did add about 10 litres to the gas, that sat for 3 months...maybe that's why it took around 8 pulls before it started.
After it's warm, about a half pull...only thing added to the gas other than the oil is sea foam.
Been working to much this year, only using the boat once a week...still starts cold on the third pull.
I think 2 strokes are great, at least the semi older ones
I can't believe gas would go bad in a week and if I had to go through what you do each time....I think I'd go all electric or canoe.
.

 

[richg99]

Zum.....do you have ten percent ethanol in your gas? That certainly had made keeping fuel more difficult IMHO.

 

[Y_J]

Zum » July 3rd, 2014, 5:20 pm[/url]"]
I can't believe gas would go bad in a week and if I had to go through what you do each time....I think I'd go all electric or canoe.
.

There's always the possibility of getting a propane outboard

 

[Zum]

Zum.....do you have ten percent ethanol in your gas? That certainly had made keeping fuel more difficult IMHO.

I'm not sure if there is any ethanol in our gas up here...heard talk it's here?.(maybe problems then)
Chainsaws(15an20 yrs old),weed-eaters,lawn mowers, outboards(2)..never have drained them...

Only reason I posted my results is to let people know, a lot(probably most) of 2 stroke outboards, run just fine.
I can't see some person in a third world country draining(discarding) gas, each time they don't use their outboard for a week, me either at $1.40/liter...I just give it the smell check,after months.
Do people realize how many 2 stroke outboards are around and for how long?
Sure there are lemons,, but there is with everything.

 

[onthewater102]

turbotodd » 03 Jul 2014, 00:55[/url]"]...I've noticed on mine (F25 yamaha) that if I don't use the fuel for more than a week, or maybe a little longer, it doesn't run quite right. hesitation sometimes...

I leave my gas sitting well over a month in the tank for my Johnson between uses with no stabilizer and don't have any issues (anecdotal point I know...but still.) For you to be having problems after such a short amount of time could be that your can isn't sealed properly and you're getting condensation mixing in the gas at night. Thanks to the 10% ethanol we have to put up with in 'Murica these days that water mixes in rather than settling out and can make your engine run less than perfect.

You're the only person I've heard of having issues after gas sitting for such a short period of time. I don't even put stabilizer in my tractor and it sits all winter and still runs fine.

 

[Bucket69]

A little off topic, but I'm with Zum on this one...gas doesn't go "bad" any quicker just because it has ethanol in it. It just corrodes the carb quicker. A lot quicker depending on the cab and what metal the jets are made of.

A little update on the motor...after messing with it and never getting it running Tuesday night, wednesday I hit the button and it fired right up and has been running great the past couple days. Go figure.

 

[richg99]

Bucket. Congratulations. Must have been the Tin boats MOJO effect. Well done. Richg99

 

[MikeG81]

Sounds like a lot of weirdness going on.

The '90 8hp Merc I used last year never gave any trouble at all. I treated all the fuel with Startron, and ran it dry at the end of every weekend. Before I sold it back in May, I fired it up in the bucket to wake it up from the winter and it took one pull to start.

Our 4 stroke 9.9 has so far been the same. Choke, 2 pushes on the primer and one pull. Run it dry at the end of the weekend, come back 2 weeks later, fires right up.

 

[dhoganjr]

Gas issues are the #1 problem around here, most boats have a vented tank, the gas expands and contracts with the heat and cold. The ethynol in the gas helps absorb moisture, the water heavier than gas goes to the bottom of the tank, you go to start the engine and straight shot of water right into the engine.

Even so called ethynol free gas contains some ethynol and most of the new 2-strokes require 87 octane. Most of the ethynol free is 91 octane which burns cooler introducing more carbon build-up inside the engine, which equals more problems.

I draw the line at 2 months, at that time I drain the tank(s) if I haven't used it, and put it in the car. Top the car's tank off with fresh gas and add fuel injection cleaner. I then usually get worse fuel milage for a trip or 2, then all is back to normal. Next time I take the boat out, add new fuel and no problems.

It is a hassle but these new outboards cost too much to take the risk and what little time I get on the water now I don't want to spend trying to keep it running.

 

[ccm]

dhoganjr » 04 Jul 2014, 16:55[/url]"]Gas issues are the #1 problem around here, most boats have a vented tank, the gas expands and contracts with the heat and cold. The ethynol in the gas helps absorb moisture, the water heavier than gas goes to the bottom of the tank, you go to start the engine and straight shot of water right into the engine.

Even so called ethynol free gas contains some ethynol and most of the new 2-strokes require 87 octane. Most of the ethynol free is 91 octane which burns cooler introducing more carbon build-up inside the engine, which equals more problems.

I draw the line at 2 months, at that time I drain the tank(s) if I haven't used it, and put it in the car. Top the car's tank off with fresh gas and add fuel injection cleaner. I then usually get worse fuel milage for a trip or 2, then all is back to normal. Next time I take the boat out, add new fuel and no problems.

It is a hassle but these new outboards cost too much to take the risk and what little time I get on the water now I don't want to spend trying to keep it running.

Yep a vented tank with ethanol gas will go bad really quick. I had gas go bad in a week. You could actually see the phase separation. I drained the gas off the top & put it in the mower. My main problem with my motor ( 2011 4hp Tohatsu 4 stroke bought new in 2013 ) was the vented internal tank. I just couldn't keep the moisture out so this year I got everything I needed to hook up an external tank. The motor was fine all of last spring & summer but when fall came with the rain the ethanol drew the moisture right in. I run premium in it now with Stabil ( I always used Stabil ). With the motors fuel economy I can justify the higher cost of premium gas.

 

[Y_J]

MikeG81 » July 4th, 2014, 5:50 pm[/url]"]Sounds like a lot of weirdness going on.

It Haunted :twisted:

 

[hwew]

Bucket69 » Yesterday, 16:07[/url]"]A little off topic, but I'm with Zum on this one...gas doesn't go "bad" any quicker just because it has ethanol in it. It just corrodes the carb quicker. A lot quicker depending on the cab and what metal the jets are made of.

A little update on the motor...after messing with it and never getting it running Tuesday night, wednesday I hit the button and it fired right up and has been running great the past couple days. Go figure.

Been going over the posts and there could be other issues.

Let's start off with fuel.
Ethanol fuel causes problems if not treated. Even when treated and not used for a month it can cause problems. Another thing is most here don't know to drain the fuel line after use. The fuel can go bad and cause starting problems if it goes bad. The reason I am bringing it up is it happened to me in 1999 with my 1995 6hp Yamaha outboard. Never had a problem until it sat for 2 months. Put new fuel in the tank, got to the lake and it took about ten pulls to fire up. Let it warm up and took off. The thing was bogging down and sputtering. It would not run. Luckily the fuel line had quick disconnects on both ends. Had a clear bowel and bolt and pushed the ball in and drained all the fuel out. One drained I looked at it an it did not look right. The fuel was separated. Than I proceeded to drain the carb and fuel filter. After completed I primed the engine and it fired up and idled as it should. I took it out and it ran fine.
The fuel went bad. At that time I lived in Connecticut and the fuel had NTBE in the early 90's. This was some nasty fuel and caused many problems.

Now, there are ethanol free fuels around in most states. Here is a site that might help. https://pure-gas.org

Next it could be signs of the fuel pump needing replacement or rebuild.

I had eleven 2-strokes in my lifetime and the only problem I ever encountered was that one time I posted above.

Glad you got it running!

 

[richg99]

Another unfortunate ethanol story. Great running Yamaha. Wisc. started using ethanol. Two month later... troubles.

Wound up replacing the hose and bulb. Ethanol had messed up the INTERIOR of the older hose. New hoses have ethanol proof coatings. The old one didn't.

 

[Mel Taylor]

The debate on whether ethanol in gasoline causes the gas to go bad quicker than gasoline without ethanol always intrigues me. I live in Southern New Mexico not too far from El Paso, Texas. Although we are located in a river valley, we are surrounded by desert, so humidity is relatively low except during our rainy season (in years when we have a real rainy season) and even then it's lower than the eastern and southern portions of the U.S.

Our winters here are generally mild and our summers brutally hot and dry. My boat, motor and gas are stored under a metal "carport " type canopy year round.

I'm running a 1997, 30 horse, electric start, Evinrude on a sixteen foot, 1982, vee hull, Blue Fin tinnie.

I often let untreated gas containing 10% ethanol set for five or six months in a portable metal six gallon tank without any apparent deterioration and have never had any trouble getting it to run on the gas left in the tank. Three or four years ago I stopped running the carb dry at the end of each trip and again, no problems. Lately, ditto on the fuel hose, which is an Evinrude brand hose. Never has my motor given me any trouble either in starting or running after setting for a period of time.

I'm not denying or downplaying the idea that other people have had problems with stored gas going bad and have no idea whether the addition of ethanol makes it go bad faster or not. But, I wonder how much local weather and climate has to do with how long gas will last before starting to deteriorate? Also wonder how much storage conditions have to do with the gasoline longevity problem.

Enquiring Minds Want To Know :lol:

 

[fireball1983]

Im new here but love fishing, getting a boat ready,now to do some fishing.but Im going to try using a higher octane instead of the 87 grade this time. had some one who told me after he switched to the next higher octane his starting problems went away. Ill know if that is true or not pretty soon.

 

[richg99]

Before switching octane...you might want to read this article

https://www.chattanoogafishingforum.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=50110&posts=16&start=1

 

[onthewater102]

Mel Taylor » 05 Jul 2014, 12:00[/url]"]...I live in Southern New Mexico not too far from El Paso, Texas. ..we are surrounded by desert, so humidity is relatively low..I often let untreated gas containing 10% ethanol set for five or six months in a portable metal six gallon tank without any apparent deterioration and have never had any trouble getting it to run on the gas left in the tank....

I believe this is strong (albeit anecdotal) support for those of us who believe that the ethanol containing gas will absorb moisture from the air and foul up the gas over time.

 

[Y_J]

onthewater102 » July 6th, 2014, 10:26 am[/url]"]

Mel Taylor » 05 Jul 2014, 12:00[/url]"]...I live in Southern New Mexico not too far from El Paso, Texas. ..we are surrounded by desert, so humidity is relatively low..I often let untreated gas containing 10% ethanol set for five or six months in a portable metal six gallon tank without any apparent deterioration and have never had any trouble getting it to run on the gas left in the tank....

I believe this is strong (albeit anecdotal) support for those of us who believe that the ethanol containing gas will absorb moisture from the air and foul up the gas over time.

I live down in Georgia and for us here where I'm at, a low humidity day is around 50=60% but more often than not it's up over 75%. I just checked my WeatherBug and right now it's sitting at 92.3%. UGGGG no wonder I'm sitting here sweating at 76 degrees.
Point is, I was going to take my rig out yesterday and give it a run on the Chattahoochee River but after sitting for a couple of weeks I couldn't get it to start at all. Finally just gave up and read one of my magazines instead. So I'm actually beginning to believe all I keep reading here about the problems with the e-gas.