Lithium Battery Question - 50AH LiFeP04 for a 55# thrust Minn Kota?

[PriceTR24speed]

What you've heard is correct. The reason is clear in my earlier post with the discharge graph. Simple voltage meters work by measuring voltage of the lead acid battery. The voltage curves are different for different batteries. There are numerous battery meters available. I use the Victron SmartShunt and it's great, although expensive. Make sure you get a waterproof version or have a safe location in the boat for it.

Can you use the SmartShunt to monitor multiple batteries? Does it have that capability or maybe connect via a selector switch of some kind?

 

[sonny.barile]

 

[MrGiggles]

I have been told the battery meter built in the head of an electric motor and standard lead acid battery meters will not work with this battery. What battery meter are you using.

Correct, you can use a standalone battery meter that will track discharge over time, and some batteries can pair with your phone via bluetooth and view charge status that way.

 

[fwman1]

I will say that it has been a long time since I have trusted Amazon reviews, especially since they started the third party sales. That being said, I think that a good number of the batteries available are good enough for our purposes.

I've spent so much on my boat, motor, and fishing gear that taking a chance on a no-name battery just didn't add up for me. There have been a couple of instances where a supplier has cheapened up their products after sending out better products to be reviewed. Weise for one. Trust has to be earned, and amazon reviews just don't cut it for me any longer.

 

[Vader809]

I find it hard to believe the biggest majority of reviews on Amazon. If I really trusted the third party, I would buy from their stores. However some are pushing the Patreon factor by just letting you see a sped up clip.
I purchased a Miller tech 12 volt 33 amp just for my electronics and I am impressed. My local tackle shop has them for $249
99 that is a good deal for me

 

[sonny.barile]

As I stated earlier……the majority of information about the inner workings of these batteries comes from ”influencers”. They get paid and/or get free product. I dont trust that……..

I did see one video of a test on Wiese batteries where the influencer was pleased with the product. Months later he took annother Wiese apart and stated the cells and construction were of a different grade than originally sold and the thermal sensor was there but not connected. Bait and switch?

I bought a Vmax because they are an already long established brand for trolling motors with the Vmax Charge Tank AGM. Very few reviews for their Lithium series…….but I rolled the dice that they would want to keep the good name.

If a battery is popular on RV sites then it’s probably good quality. Those folks truly torture batteries when it comes to life length and real time testing.

This is only my opinion and ymmv………

 

[CRS]

Many reviews on Amazon and most other sites are nothing but first impressions. People buy something and review it the moment it arrives without ever actually using it. I buy a lot of things off Amazon, most products are very easy to return. That is the plus about Amazon. Unfortunately Amazon also sells a lot of trash, like all big box stores. Quality control is non existent in China that's why everything sourced from China is a shot in the dark. When it comes to batteries any batteries I prefer established brands. Most if not all LI battery cells are produced in China, the companies that are reputable do a 100% quality check before assembly. That explains the price difference from those that do not. While the majority of the cells are OK it only takes one to cause a problem.
Just my biased 2 cents worth, I admit I dislike everything about China.

 

[Tin Man]

This is interesting to me. I see some "strangely named" batteries on Amazon for about half the price of many I see here.

Many are $159 - $169 and most have hundreds of reviews with 4.5 star ratings. Eco-Worthy, Nermark, and a few others have thousands of reviews and still maintain a very high rating. Very few failures, and the few duds replaced with a fairly simple process.

There are others that have 3 and 4 stars, but when you read the reviews, the customer service is lame.

I am considering buying two 50AH batteries for my 24V Terrova from the better reviewed economy batteries. The economics and numbers seem to support this.

That being said, I've had them in my cart since the beginning of this thread, but haven't pulled the trigger yet. Wimp!

I’m considering upgrading my 12v TM to a 24V Terrova. I was set on two 12V deep cycle batteries due to their relatively low cost and great dependability. Obviously they are about 65# each.

What calculations did you use to determine that two 50ah lithiums are sufficient? I’ve read about needing more ah for a 24V TM…ex two 100 ah.
What Brand are you considering?
Price each?

Thanks!

 

[Lost But Happy]

I might also mention that the battery I purchased is now only $250.

Please share!

I have scoured the internet and have not found the Epoch 12v 50a cheaper than $299 (on Epoch's website).

Im 95% sold on getting the Epoch for my TM. I've done quite a bit of research/comparisons and what put the Epoch to the top of the list is the UL rating. Thank you @dcbz

I've compared stats, features and price (battery + mfg's charger + shipping) for Amped, Dakota, Ionic, Weize and Epoch. In my unqualified opinion, Epoch is the best value.

The only downside is the 11 year warranty. Let's see what happens at the 37th month. lol

 

[sonny.barile]

Please share!

I have scoured the internet and have not found the Epoch 12v 50a cheaper than $299 (on Epoch's website).

Im 95% sold on getting the Epoch for my TM. I've done quite a bit of research/comparisons and what put the Epoch to the top of the list is the UL rating. Thank you @dcbz

I've compared stats, features and price (battery + mfg's charger + shipping) for Amped, Dakota, Ionic, Weize and Epoch. In my unqualified opinion, Epoch is the best value.

The only downside is the 11 year warranty. Let's see what happens at the 37th month. lol

Walmart…..Vmax 55 amp.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/VMAX-LFP...Battery-weight-15-5LBS/354947063?from=/search

 

[Lost But Happy]

Walmart…..Vmax 55 amp.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/VMAX-LFP...Battery-weight-15-5LBS/354947063?from=/search

Thank you @sonny.barile! I'll take a gander and compare it.

 

[fwman1]

Please share!

I have scoured the internet and have not found the Epoch 12v 50a cheaper than $299 (on Epoch's website).

Im 95% sold on getting the Epoch for my TM. I've done quite a bit of research/comparisons and what put the Epoch to the top of the list is the UL rating. Thank you @dcbz

I've compared stats, features and price (battery + mfg's charger + shipping) for Amped, Dakota, Ionic, Weize and Epoch. In my unqualified opinion, Epoch is the best value.

The only downside is the 11 year warranty. Let's see what happens at the 37th month. lol

The Epoch site had it on sale for the fourth of July.
It is back at 299.00. if you subscribe to their news letter they will send you a discount code. I paid about 297 shipped with the code and received the battery the day after I ordered it. They also offer discount codes via Facebook. For me, the gauge is one of the best features. It is bright and easy to read. Using the app to verify, it is also accurate.

 

[fwman1]

I’m considering upgrading my 12v TM to a 24V Terrova. I was set on two 12V deep cycle batteries due to their relatively low cost and great dependability. Obviously they are about 65# each.

What calculations did you use to determine that two 50ah lithiums are sufficient? I’ve read about needing more ah for a 24V TM…ex two 100 ah.
What Brand are you considering?
Price each?

Thanks!

Check out this information on the Epoch site. I think it will help. Look at the bottom of the page for the recommendations, although the entire article is useful info.
https://www.epochbatteries.com/pages/best-trolling-motor-battery

 

[bigcity]

.....The only downside is the 11 year warranty. Let's see what happens at the 37th month. lol

Come on now, 11yrs, 11 YEARS?? if I buy any sort of battery and it lasts 11 frick'n years without issues I'm going to be more than satisfied. My next stop online this morning will be Epoch batteries.

I agree with online testimonials being mostly garbage.

 

[thill]

What idiot short circuits a battery?!? Or doesn't fuse protects circuits?

I'm 30 seconds in, and immediately I don't want to listen to anything this guys says, but I'm going to keep watching...

 

[sonny.barile]

He did it on purpose………… When I saw that I was like……hey……give that battery to me if you don’t want it anymore…


I posted that because that battery company got an immediate good reputation based on reviews on Amazon. Later, after establishing a good reputation, they started sending out low quality crap.

 

[thill]

Well, it got a little better. Basically, the battery was fine and gave good power curve, but the BMS didn't provide adequate short circuit protection.
So don't short circuit your batteries, and always use fuses or circuit breakers in your setups, especially if it's a cheap battery.

AGM and lead acid batteries have never had a BMS, but if it's supposed to protect, IT SHOULD. Good point, Sonny!

Still, it's too bad he pitched it. I'm guessing many people who avoid short circuiting batteries would have been happy to take it off his hands and use it for years with no issues.

 

[thill]

I’m considering upgrading my 12v TM to a 24V Terrova. I was set on two 12V deep cycle batteries due to their relatively low cost and great dependability. Obviously they are about 65# each.

What calculations did you use to determine that two 50ah lithiums are sufficient? I’ve read about needing more ah for a 24V TM…ex two 100 ah.
What Brand are you considering?
Price each?

Thanks!

I based this on a number of others who are running that setup, and the calculation that a 50AH lithium is supposed to yield about the same use per charge as the 100AH DC lead batteries that I'm currently running.

So, in theory, I shouldn't lose anything, and will gain a much greater longevity for about the same price.

That being said... as prices go down, I'm leaning toward going ahead with the 100AH LiFeP0 batteries. The reason is, my 24V Riptide is always fighting heavy currents, so gaining TWICE the useable run time is pretty desirable.

I just need to justify making the jump, which is what's slowing me down. The DC batteries are working pretty great after 18 months, but I suspect they are about halfway through their lifespan.

The battery brand in the forefront is the TimeUSB brand for $279 after coupon, including shipping: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BBZL5BPR

I base that choice on some pretty good reviews.

 

[sonny.barile]

I finally got a weather window to get out and do some testing.

TM - MG xi3 55 lb. 12v.
Battery - 65 amp lifepo4
Boat - 16 ft

I checked boat speed going with the tidal current on max TM speed for 2 minutes. I was moving at 3.8 mph. Then I turned it into the current and speed dropped to 1.8 mph.

I ran it against the tidal current on max. TM speed for 30 minutes non stop then used the spotlock for an additional 10 minutes.

When I got home I checked the voltage and it was just over 13.3v. That equates to 90 percent capacity remaining.

Seems like a solid battery choice for my use. The price was great as I ended up paying $229

The lost weight in the bow made loading and unloading easier. I could feel the difference……..

 

[sonny.barile]

Well, it got a little better. Basically, the battery itself was fine and gave good power curve, but the BMS didn't provide adequate short circuit protection. Too bad he pitched it. I'm guessing many people who DON'T short circuit batteries would have been happy to take it off his hands and use it for years with no issues.

Lesson learned: Don't short circuit your batteries, especially cheap, economy batteries. And always use fuses or circuit breakers in your setups.

Wait... Didn't we know that already??

Yes…most adults know this…….but sometimes a wrench falls from your hand……or some fresk accident happens. The battery was sold to the consumer as having protection for that.……Is it ok to market features that end up not really being there?

Weise did that too……they marketed thermal protection as a feature….and sent out some where the thermal circuit was in the case but not hooked up. Unless these crazy YouTubers didn’t take one apart…….you would think it’s still a quality battery.


It is a shame to waste a perfectly good battery…….